:: orochinagi

Obviously the game is still too new for any definite tier lists. Here're just two tier lists from around the net. This one was posted in KOF Union and and was flamed at quite a bit:

ＳＳＳ　クラウザー　ギース（表）　庵
Krauser, Geese, Iori

ＳＳ　クリス（裏）　ギース（裏）　チョイ
Chris (Orochi), Geese, (Ex), Choi

Ｓ　大門　テリー（表裏）　柴舟　タクマ
Daimon, Terry (Both), Saisyu, Takuma

Ａ　ブライアン　リョウ（表）　キング（表裏）　クリス（表）　社（裏）　アテナ　ＢＩＧ
Brian, Ryo, King (Both), Chris, Yashiro (Orochi), Athena, Mr. Big

Ｂ　キム　マチュア　山崎（表裏）　ユリ（裏）　ちづる　紅丸　リョウ（裏）　ロバート（表）　京（裏）　ハイデルン
Kim, Mature, Yamazaki (both), Yuri (Ex), Benimaru, Kagura, Ryo (Ex), Robert, Kyo (Ex), Heidern

Ｃ　香澄　ユリ（表）　レオナ　影二　社（表）　舞（表裏）　マリー（表裏）　ジョー（表裏）　京（表）　ラルフ
Kasumi, Yuri (Normal), Leona, Eiji, Yashiro, Mai (Both), Mary (Both), Joe (Both), Kyo, Ralf

Ｄ　クラーク　ヘビィＤ　チャン　バイス　ビリー（表裏）　アンディ（表裏）　シェルミー（表）　ロバート（裏）
Clark, Heavy D!, Chang, Robert (Ex), Vice, Billy (Both), Andy (Both), Shermie

Ｅ シェルミー（裏） 真吾 ラッキーケンスウ　　チン　
Shermie (Orochi), Shingo, Lucky

Missing? - Kensou, Chin, Rugal.


Here's another one that Empyrian found on a Jap website:

Top 10 : Iori, Krauser, Ex King, Geese (Both Ex and Normal), Choi, Yuri (Normal), Daimon, Kyo, Orochi Chris

At least what's interesting is that Iori, Krauser, Orochi Chris, Both Geeses, Daimon and Choi all seem to feature promininently on both lists. Iori, O.Chris and Geese all have easy cross up+big damage hop offensives, and O.Chris and Takuma are REALLY scary when they have 3 stocks in Advance mode. Krauser is well... you've all seen the vids by now. Daimon lost his ground pound bug but still has high priority normals and scary damage. Choi's just got a really safe offense and easy DM combo overall. I think his far A is cancellable into his Rush DM now.

Edited:

Cause i remember the second list wrongly. Eiji and Takuma aren't in it. Daimon is.

God, what happened to Shingo? He was pretty good in 98 as I remember, plus there was that annoying Guard Crush from his Kake Hourin DM which was cancelable. And Kyo in C rank?! Wasn't he one of the top tiers in 98?

Like I said. Its a preliminary list that's been flamed quite a bit. The only thing that everybody really seems to agree on is that Iori and Krauser are up on top.

Kyo's still pretty strong, so I dunno what the guy who made the first list was smoking. Still it suggests that beyond Iori and Krauser, the rest of the cast seems fairly balanced so far, so the ranks are close together. Hell, I think O.Shermie is pretty damn strong this year with instantaneous electric kisses at all distances. She's one of my picks for possible anti-Krauser match ups.

Shingo... no idea. Haven't seen enough people play him to form an impression.

I also think that when all's said and done, some characters are going to benefit a lot more from Extra Mode's Q.Max than others, so tiers are going to shift when/if Extra becomes competitive. Right now it seems like almost everyone still sticks with Advanced.

Wow, Krauser and Geese get pretty high rankings. I'm guessing they aren't a direct port of the 96 versions?

Why normal Geese over EX? :S

Kensou and Chin are in E rank from what it says.

And something tells me they wanted Iori top on purpose. Guy was top in normal 98 and it seems he wasn't nerfed one bit. Pleasing Iori fans = more profit?

Well supposedly his Aoi Hana was slowed down, and i don't see it being used effectively as a poke, so I guess it has.

And honestly, I'm guessing if you were asked how you would tone down Vanilla '98 Iori to balance the game, slowing down the Aoi Hana would've been number one on the list.

The thing is, he still has lots of things that make him hella good- invincible C uppercut, early hop back+B connecting into full ground combo, fast fireball+stupid ass back hop bug. All these things were nerfed in later games, but I guess since they wanted to balance 98UM with tweezers, rather than a hammer (which is generally a good approach when you talking about balancing a game that's arguably the most balanced game you've made in 14 years) they decided not to mess with those.

I'm still hoping that in the long run this game will turn out to be better balanced than '98. The SBO results should be a pretty good indicator if we'll still be playing this game 10 years down the road.

Total Character Usage amongst those who've qualified So Far (Out of 53 qualifying tournaments)
Krauser: 19, Iori: 16, Ex Geese: 13, Ex King: 13, Kyo: 10, Orochi Yashiro: 10, Orochi Chris: 8, Ex Yuri: 7, Rugal: 4, Daimon: 4, Random: 3, Ralf: 3, Kensou: 3, Chris: 4, Brian: 3, Mai: 3, Clark: 3, King: 3, Ex Kyo: 2, Geese: 2, Choi: 2, Eiji: 2, Yuri: 2, Yashiro: 2, Orochi Shermie: 2, Leona: 2, Kim: 1, Saisyu: 1, Takuma: 1, Athena: 1, Yamazaki: 1, Heavy D!: 1, Andy: 1, Kagura: 1, Mature: 1, Vice: 1, Shermie: 1, Ex Robert: 1, Shingo: 1, Kasumi: 1

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Got these off the Tougeki official website and here http://jbbs.livedoor.jp/bbs/read.cgi/ga ... 088592/l50

To be updated as more qualifiers are held. Feel free to add to the list or correct me since I don't know any nipponese.

These will be placed in the following format: Date:Location / Team Played by Winner / Team Played by Runner Up

4/5: G-PORTラスベガス / 京・クラウザー・裏社 / 庵・裏ギース・クラウザー 33 Players
Kyo, Krauser, Orochi Yashiro
Iori, Ex Geese, Krauser

4/5: アミューズランドガディス / ヘビィＤ！、クラウザー、裏キング - ? Players
Heavy D!, Krauser, Ex King

4/6: GAME NEWTON大山店 / 庵、クラウザー、裏ギース -35 Players
Iori, Krauser, Ex Geese

4/6: ワンダーパーク 博多 / 裏京・庵・裏社 / 表テリー・表社・ルガール 16 Players
Ex Kyo, Iori, Orochi Yashiro
Terry, Yashiro, Rugal

4/12: ムー大陸 稲毛店 / 京、裏杜、庵 / 裏ロバート、紅丸、アンディ 15 Players
Kyo, Orochi Yashiro, Iori
Robert, Benimaru, Andy

4/12: セガ 三宮SANX / キング(裏)・チョイ・クラウザー / ちづる・庵・クラウザー 20 Players
Ex King, Choi, Krauser
Kagura, Iori, Krauser

4/13: タイトーステーション溝の口 / レオナ、裏ユリ、キング -? Players
Leona, Ex Yuri, King

4/13: おもしろランドAHAHAH / クラウザー、タクマ、裏ギース - ? Players
Krauser, Takuma , Ex Geese

4/19: GAMEGARAGE大宮店 / 裏ユリ、庵、クラウザー / ユリ、裏キング、クラウザー 42 Players
Ex Yuri, Iori, Krauser
Yuri, King, Krauser

4/19: アミバラ広島店 / 裏キング・裏ギース・チョイ / 庵・チョイ・大門 - ? Players
Ex King, Ex Geese, Choi
Iori, Choi, Daimon

4/20: 埼玉POPY / ユリ　裏キング　クラウザー / 庵　クラウザー　山崎 -28 Players
Yuri, Ex King, Krauser
Iori, Krauser, Yamazaki

4/20: MAXPLAZA善通寺 / ランダム×3 / 表ｸﾘｽ・庵・裏社 - 12 Players
RandomX3
Chris, Iori, Orochi Yashiro
Yes Wtf. Someone qualified with 3 random characters. Only 12 people took part in this qualifier though.

4/26: スーパービンゴ郡山店 / 庵、京、裏クリス / -20 Players
Iori, Kyo, Orochi Chris
Iori, Krauser, Ex Yuri

4/26: ハイテクランド セガ アビオン / 裏キング、裏ギース、クラウザー / MR.BIG、ギース、クラウザー 29 Players
Ex King, Ex Geese, Krauser
Mr. Big, Geese, Krauser
Apparently someone called FRiONEL took part in the quarter finals. Was is the same Frionel who posts here? o.O

4/27: 新宿スポーツランド本館 / 裏ギース・裏クリス・ルガール / クラウザー・庵・裏社 / 59 Players
Ex Geese, Orochi Chris, Rugal
Krauser, Iori, Orochi Yashiro
Yes. A Rugal player came out top in a 59 player tournament. So who's lower tier now eh?

4/27: ファンパラダイス志度 / 山崎、裏ギース、大門 -? Players
Yamazaki, Ex Geese , Daimon

4/29: ゲームチャリオット辰巳店 / 表社・紫舟・ケンスウ / バイス・庵・表クリス - 23 Players
Yashiro, Saisyu, Kensou
Vice, Iori, Chris

4/29: アミューズメントパークステップ / キム　クラウザー　裏社 / アテナ　ケンスウ　鎮 - 16 Players
Kim, Krauser, Orochi Yashiro
Athena, Kensou, Chin

5/3: POWER STICK / 裏クリス、裏キング、アテナ - ? Players
Orochi Chris, Ex King, Athena

5/4: キャッツアイ新札幌店 / ウラギース・ウラクリス・クラウザー / イオリ・ウラアンディ・クラウザー - 11 Players
Ex Geese, Ex Chris, Krauser
Iori, Ex Andy, Krauser

5/4: プラボ 上尾店 / クラウザー・裏キング・ブライアン / へビィＤ！・ラッキー・ブライアン 30 Players
Krauser, Ex King, Brian
Heavy D, Lucky, Brian
Yeah pretty amazing. In a 30 player qualifier, it came down to 2 Brian users and one was using the full American Sports team.

5/5: ゲームワールド伊勢崎 / ラルフ・クラーク・裏社 / 裏ユリ・クラーク・裏キング - 16 Players
Ralf, Clark, Orochi Yashiro
Ex Yuri, Clark, Ex King

5/5: フタバ図書GIGAZONE広島駅前店 / ブライアン/裏キング/クラウザー / 裏キング/アテナ/ケンスウ - 20 Players
Brian, Ex King, Krauser
Ex King, Athena, Kensou

5/6: アドアーズ大和店B館 / 【草薙　京】【八神　庵】【クラウザー】 / 【社　(裏)】【八神　庵】【クラウザー】 - 16 Players
Kyo, Iori, Krauser
Orochi Yashiro, Iori, Krauser

5/10: ゲームカレッジ / 京、庵、裏ユリ - ?
Kyo, Iori, Ex Yuri

5/11: 西条プラザゲームコーナー / 裏ギース・京・裏キング / 庵・影二・裏キング - 16 Players
Ex Geese, Kyo, Ex King
Iori, Eiji, Ex King

5/11: ルパン122 / 千鶴、裏京、裏クリス / 裏クリス、表ユリ、表マリー- 23 Players
Kagura, Ex Kyo, Orochi Chris
Orochi Chris, Yuri, Mary

5/17: クラブ セガ 新宿西口 / アンディ、ギース、Ωルガール / 裏ユリ、裏ギース、クラウザー 55 Players
Andy, Geese, Omega Rugal??
Ex Yuri, Ex Geese, Krauser
Eeeeerrrrr..... Omega Rugal? Wtf? Its probably a joking way of saying that his Rugal was really impressive, but ionno...

5/17: アミューズメントスクエア・チャンス白根店 / クラーク･大門・クラウザー / 裏マリー・表京・裏社 - 16 Players
Clark, Daimon, Krauser
Ex Mary, Kyo, Orochi Yashiro

5/18: GAME SPOT21 新宿西口 / イオリ、裏ギース、裏キング / 表ギース、エイジ、ケンスウ - 32 Players
Iori, Ex Geese, Ex King
Geese, Eiji, Kensou
エイジ = Eiji?

5/18: エンジョイパラダイス / 庵、クラウザー、裏社 / 大門、裏社、ラルフ - 25 Players
Iori, Krauser, Orochi Yashiro
Daimon Orochi Yashiro, Ralf

5/24: アブレイズ湘南台店 / 影二・京・クリス / キング・マリー・香澄 - 25 Players
Eiji, Kyo, Chris
King, Mary, Kasumi

5/24: ウェルカム / 庵・大門・裏クリス / アテナ・チン・ケンスウ - 9 Players
Iori, Daimon, Orochi Chris
Athena, Chang (?), Kensou

5/25: アミューズメントエース津田沼 / ギース・影二・ケンスウ / 庵・裏ユリ・クラウザー - 36 Players
Geese, Eiji, Kensou
Iori, Ex Yuri, Krauser

5/31: 東京レジャーランド小岩店 / 庵・京・裏ユリ / ロバート・クリス・クラウザー - 32 Players
Iori, Kyo, Ex Yuri
Robert, Chris, Krauser

6/1: チャレンジャー関大前店 / 大門・裏社・ラルフ / 庵・紅丸・裏社 - 17 Players
Daimon, Orochi Yashiro, Ralf
Iori, Benimaru, Orochi Yashiro

6/7: チャリオット姉崎店 / 裏ギース・クラウザー・ラルフ / イオリ・クラウザー・裏ヤシロ - 24 Players
Ex Geese, Krauser, Ralf
Iori, Krauser, Orochi Yashiro

6/8: MAXIM HERO / マチュア・ヴァイス・裏ユリ / 庵・裏社・裏クリス - 13 Players
Mature, Vice, Ex Yuri
Iori, Orochi Yashiro, Orochi Chris

6/8: イスカンダル / 社、ユリ、クリス / レオナ、裏ユリ、庵 - 22 Players
Yashiro, Yuri, Chris
Leona, Ex Yuri, Iori

6/14: ブラックジャック安古市店 / 舞、裏シェルミー、クリス / ラッキー、ケンスウ、影二 - 19 Players
Mai, Orochi Shermie, Chris
Lucky, Kensou, Eiji

6/14: 遊食空間XYZ / 裏クリス　京　シェルミー / 京　庵　クラウザー - 11 Players
Orochi Chris, Kyo, Shermie
Kyo, Iori, Krauser

6/15: JOYPLAZA / 裏ギース、庵、クラウザー / 庵、クラウザー、裏ユリ - 10 Players
Ex Geese, Iori, Krauser
Iori, Krauser, Ex Yuri

6/15: プラボ 宇都宮店 / 庵、裏ユリ、裏キング / ロバート、クリス、クラウザー - 28 Players
Iori, Ex Yuri, Ex King
Robert, Chris, Krauser

6/21: アミューズメントスクエアチャンス笹口店 / クラーク/裏キング/裏ユリ / 庵/京/クラーク - 16 Players
Clark, Ex King, Ex Yuri
Iori, Kyo, Clark

6/21: スーパーノバ天童 / 庵、クラウザー、裏社 / 裏シェルミー、裏ユリ、ブライアン - 15 Players
Iori, Krauser, Orochi Yashiro
Orochi Shermie, Ex Yuri, Brian

6/22: ファンタジスタ / 裏ギース、裏社、クラウザー / 裏ユリ、庵、クリス - 19 Players
Ex Geese, Orochi Yashiro, Krauser
Ex Yuri, Iori, Chris

6/22: ゲームディルレイ国分寺店 / 裏ギース・ルガール・拳崇 / 庵・京・裏ギース - 40 Players
Ex Geese, Rugal, Kensou
Iori, Kyo, Ex Geese

6/28: ビバーチャ2 / 裏ロバート、表キング、裏社 / ??? - 15 Players
Ex Robert, King, Orochi Yashiro
???

6/28: ゲーム・スポット大橋 / 裏シェルミィ・ブライアン・キング / 裏ギース・クラウザー・マイ - 16 Players
Orochi Shermie, Brian, King
Ex Geese, Krauser, ???

6/29: ピンクパンサー つくばみらい店 / 表京、真吾、ルガール / ??? - 38 Players
Kyo, Shingo, Rugal
???

7/5: GAME FANTASIO敦賀店 / 庵・舞・クリス / ラッキー・拳崇・影二 - 13 Players
Iori, Mai, Chris
Lucky, Kensou, Eiji

7/5: 桜の牧アミューズパーク / 表舞・香澄・裏キング / イオリ・レオナ・裏クリス - 30 Players
Mai, Kasumi, Ex King
Iori, Leona, Orochi Chris

7/6: 大久保アルファステーション / 庵・レオナ・裏クリス / 庵・裏舞・裏社 - 55 Players
Iori, Leona, Orochi Chris
Iori, Ex Mai, Orochi Yashiro

*Bumping this because I've updated the Tougeki post a lot since I last posted.*

Of special interest is the fact that Iori ISN'T the character that's been used most by the people who've qualified. Krauser is. Followed by Ex King then Ex Geese.

Bottomline: The new characters with fierballs are dominating.

At the same time, there's a pretty huge variety of characters used, so balance doesn't look that bad at all. Of the former top tiers, it looks like Kagura has fallen the most.

Will continue to update the post...

I like the store with two Brian users.

EX Geese is actually meaner than what he seems. Basically if the spacing is good, it's really hard to get close to him.

AcidicEnema wrote: 4/26: ハイテクランド セガ アビオン / 裏キング、裏ギース、クラウザー / MR.BIG、ギース、クラウザー 29 Players
Ex King, Ex Geese, Krauser
Mr. Big, Geese, Krauser
Apparently someone called FRiONEL took part in the quarter finals. Was is the same Frionel who posts here? o.O

Yup, it was me, I lost on the semi finals, against the boss team user. Cabetsu took also a part of the tournament (he came to Osaka from Tokyo for this), but he lost in the first round against the winner of the qualifier. Very good overall level, I'm still surprised about my result (I played Ex Andy, Ex Gesse and Krauser). I've also took part on the Sannomiya Sanx qualifier (Kobe), but I lost in the first bracket (RF was just a monster this day!!).

Heh. Good luck if you get to take part in any more qualifiers dude. Hope to hear more from you on how you find this game's balance at the competitive level.

I think that at this stage of the game, is too early to do a complete tier list like the one that was done before, because we still need to work on the game.

Also, the match ups depends a lot on the selected mode. Some chars gets an awesome attack power with the Extra Jauge (OMG Ryo!!!), and some with the extra evade makes a lot of problems for fireball characters, or corner trap characters, and in the other hand gets difficults in other situations where the roll is needed.

But about what I've seen in Japan (Kansai and Katou) and Beijing, I think the strongest characters now are :

SS : Iori
S : Krauser (he's more "no skill" and dumb than Iori, but has some difficult match ups that Iori doesn't have)
A : Ex King, Geese, Ex Geese, Ex Yuri, Eiji, Ex Mary, Choi, O.Yashiro, Ryo (with Extra Jauge), Benimaru (very very popular everywhere!)

Other characters like Mr Big, Yuri, Kyo, Brian, Ex Yamazaki, Leona, Takuma, Saisyu, Clark, Ex Mai are also popular and seemed to do good results.

So I think that the game is really more balanced than the original 98. Ok, Iori and Krauser, but they are way more defeatable than the 98 SS chars. Also, a lot of strong and interesting characters, all the old ones got so many new options, additionned to the differents modes.

Tiers or not, '98 was always balanced enough that it's not such a bad matchup for O. Shermie to go up against an Iori user. I suppose even with the new characters, it's still far more balanced for a Shingo vs Iori match in 98 UM than a Gato vs Whip match in XI. Iori may still be top tier, but everyone knows what to expect from an Iori player, so IMHO it's really not that bad. Hell, based on the videos, the Iori users were getting hits in from purely stupid moves, like tossing a fireball right in front of opponent who isn't waking up. Which conventionally is so moronic that it shouldn't work, but I guess with two high level players duking it out, nobody expects the other to do something THAT stupid and is unprepared when they actually do it.

Has the tiers be revised yet? Surely they have changed since page one?!!?

Honestly, everywhere I look, tier discussion for the game seems to be fairly dead, and I think its a testament to how balanced the game is. People just don't talk about tiering that much because the game just doesn't have very many distinct tiers.

Frionel's list looks pretty accurate to me, though I would personally put Iori and Krauser on par, and O.Yashiro, Both Geeses, Ex King and O.Chris at an A+ or something like that. Seriously though, this game is 10X more balanced than 98 and that in itself makes any attempt at tiering less meaningful than it would in any other KOF.